Death Penalty

[cbtslave4u2]

This is a touchy subject but I am curious to know what your views on the death penalty are. Is it ever ok or is it always wrong?

[lonelygirl316]

it is not wrong because if they are in prison they get luxories like heat, food, water ect

[cbtslave4u2]

Personally, I am in favor of the Death Penalty as long as the evidence is there to prove beyond a 95% certainty they committed the crime. The only crimes that should carry death penalty are murders, brutality and torture, kidnapping, rape, child rape and any combination of the previous crimes. I don't care if Europe doesn't sell us the drugs to kill people on death row either, we will just use the drug they put dogs to sleep with.

[userben]

when i was younger like in 7th grade i was all for old sparky but now i have the mind set that only certain situations should we use the death penalty

[cbtslave4u2]

Originally Posted by lonelygirl316

it is not wrong because if they are in prison they get luxories like heat, food, water ect

true and some people want to be in prison because that is the only life they know and know how to live. if you watch Lockup Raw on tv these inmates tell the interviewer they like it there and want to be there. so if someone goes and commits a robbery goes to prison, gets on parole,, goes and rapes and kills someone to go back to prison because he likes it there. that's not punishment.

[Aries_Laetus]

We just had this discussion in one of my classes the other week or so. The class was about 1/2 and 1/2 on it so we made a T table. On the "yes" side we put to lessen crowding, lessen cost, act as prevention and so on. On the "no" side we did its wrong, eye for an eye makes the whole world blind, vengence is not just, what if they are innocent like they are sometimes....ect. I will cut to the chase. By the end of the class we were all on the no side. We really looked at what we had on each side and rulled them all out except for the "no"' side's vengence and get them off the face of the world points. We found facts and examples for this whole thing. And the only reason we could see people justifying giving someone the death penalty was to rid them off the faace of the earth. Now, there are some truly horrifying people on this earth, and they I would gladly like to be rid of for all of our sakes. But what about the innocent? What happens to them? They die for no reason other than a bad way of doing things. I understand, they killed your little girl, she was only 22, I get that. But they have a family too. What happens to them? 1005 of people in a poll about this said they did NOT feel better after the killers death. NOT. That is the key word. If we are looking for "an eye for an eye" so to speak, and then do NOT feel better after it? Doesnt that make it wrong for everyone? Leave them in jail, let them rot in a cement room with 2 hrs of tv a day and no visitors. Let the not see how their families grow. Let them miss out on life for taking another's. I believe that is how it should be.


Sorry a bit of a rant there.

-Aries

[cbtslave4u2]

Originally Posted by Aries_Laetus

We just had this discussion in one of my classes the other week or so. The class was about 1/2 and 1/2 on it so we made a T table. On the "yes" side we put to lessen crowding, lessen cost, act as prevention and so on. On the "no" side we did its wrong, eye for an eye makes the whole world blind, vengence is not just, what if they are innocent like they are sometimes....ect. I will cut to the chase. By the end of the class we were all on the no side. We really looked at what we had on each side and rulled them all out except for the "no"' side's vengence and get them off the face of the world points. We found facts and examples for this whole thing. And the only reason we could see people justifying giving someone the death penalty was to rid them off the faace of the earth. Now, there are some truly horrifying people on this earth, and they I would gladly like to be rid of for all of our sakes. But what about the innocent? What happens to them? They die for no reason other than a bad way of doing things. I understand, they killed your little girl, she was only 22, I get that. But they have a family too. What happens to them? 1005 of people in a poll about this said they did NOT feel better after the killers death. NOT. That is the key word. If we are looking for "an eye for an eye" so to speak, and then do NOT feel better after it? Doesnt that make it wrong for everyone? Leave them in jail, let them rot in a cement room with 2 hrs of tv a day and no visitors. Let the not see how their families grow. Let them miss out on life for taking another's. I believe that is how it should be.


Sorry a bit of a rant there.

-Aries

dont be sorry, i like it when people rant on subjects like this. i can argue all day for either side but in connecticut they were about to abolish the death penalty until those animals who got out of prison early brutally raped and killed that man's family while he was beaten and tied in the basement.

they saw the mom and his daughters in a grocery store parking lot, followed them home and came back that night to rob them. they beat the man until he passed out, tied him up and threw him in the basement. meanwhile they beat the hell out of his wife, and 12 & 17 year old daughters for hours. they raped the mom repeatedly, who had MS, forcedher to the bank to withdraw $30k. raped and beat both girls repeatedly for the entire night. killedd the mom back at the house. tied the girls naked to their beds with a pillow cover over their heads. poured gasoline on them and the rest of the house and set it on fire.

they had spent like 15 years in prison already so missing out on their familys and being locked up didnt mean much to them. they got death...

[Aries_Laetus]

I have to admit, there are some people out there that I would not mind being gone forever. There are some real creeps out there. There are flaws to the death penalty however as there are in all things.

A while ago a man was sentenced to death and a weel before his date of death they looked into the case again because for however long he was in prison he said he was wrongly accused. After some digging it was found that the prosecutors withheld evidence that would have proved this man innocent but since it was already a long trial they hid it away to just get it over with. 10 people knew the truth and let this man nearly die for it. Nothing happened to these 10 people. NOTHING.

There was a sad case a few years back where the murderer of a womans entire family was finally killed. She was there of course and waiting to feel her grief lessen. His death made her feel worse as she sat next to his family in the same room and heard them cry. She went home and killed herself. Where is the justice in that?

I did answer it deends for I am not totaly sure. Like I said some people are better gone. But is that right? My favorite saying :An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind", but you know taking one eye may save a whole lot of others. Who knows for sure?

[cbtslave4u2]

Originally Posted by Aries_Laetus

I have to admit, there are some people out there that I would not mind being gone forever. There are some real creeps out there. There are flaws to the death penalty however as there are in all things.

A while ago a man was sentenced to death and a weel before his date of death they looked into the case again because for however long he was in prison he said he was wrongly accused. After some digging it was found that the prosecutors withheld evidence that would have proved this man innocent but since it was already a long trial they hid it away to just get it over with. 10 people knew the truth and let this man nearly die for it. Nothing happened to these 10 people. NOTHING.

There was a sad case a few years back where the murderer of a womans entire family was finally killed. She was there of course and waiting to feel her grief lessen. His death made her feel worse as she sat next to his family in the same room and heard them cry. She went home and killed herself. Where is the justice in that?

I did answer it deends for I am not totaly sure. Like I said some people are better gone. But is that right? My favorite saying :An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind", but you know taking one eye may save a whole lot of others. Who knows for sure?

sounds like Texas... the black guy in the rape case? i think he got $14mil. i didnt hear about that womanbut i dont think i could feel bad enough to kill myself over that because it isn't my fault he was an evil person and the prosecuter and/or state went for the death penalty.

[SilverScar]

Here we don’t have death penalty, and I’m happy with this. There will always be some people, who will be wrongly accused. If you put someone in jail, he spends there some years, then it turns out that he was innocent – you can let him go free, and the government can compensate him somehow, usually they get a huge amount of money. If you killed him there’s no way to compensate. And if only 1 from a million is wrongly accoused, it worth it to abolish death penalty.

The second thing is, what will be better if you kill those people, not just lock them up? Nothing. The U.S. has 4-5 times higher murder rate than us (and most european countries). And you have death penalty, we don’t. Do you really think that child rapists and serial killers will stop because they are afraid of death penalty? I don’t think so, they don’t care about it.

[cbtslave4u2]

Originally Posted by SilverScar

Here we don’t have death penalty, and I’m happy with this. There will always be some people, who will be wrongly accused. If you put someone in jail, he spends there some years, then it turns out that he was innocent – you can let him go free, and the government can compensate him somehow, usually they get a huge amount of money. If you killed him there’s no way to compensate. And if only 1 from a million is wrongly accoused, it worth it to abolish death penalty.

The second thing is, what will be better if you kill those people, not just lock them up? Nothing. The U.S. has 4-5 times higher murder rate than us (and most european countries). And you have death penalty, we don’t. Do you really think that child rapists and serial killers will stop because they are afraid of death penalty? I don’t think so, they don’t care about it.

i live in texas, we kill more people a year than all other states combined (around 80 people) but it takes atleast 12 years to be executed so the inmate's lawyer can do everything possible to get him/her out of it.

im unsure of the gun laws where you are but here i can go buy a fully automatic ak-47 without a background check and without a waiting period. that contributes to the high muder rate but that will never ever be changed unfortunatly.

im unsure if the murder rate you are looking at includes legal murders but if someone broke into my home right now i can legally shoot them dead without going to prison.

[cbtslave4u2]

i mean i can buy a gun like that at a gun show. if i went to a gun shop i'd have to have a background check and wait 3 days.

[SilverScar]

Yep I know that gun laws are partly responsible for the high murder rate, but if death penalty would be so effective, people wouldn't murder even if they have guns

[DarkAndEvil]

Originally Posted by SilverScar

Here we don’t have death penalty, and I’m happy with this. There will always be some people, who will be wrongly accused. If you put someone in jail, he spends there some years, then it turns out that he was innocent – you can let him go free, and the government can compensate him somehow, usually they get a huge amount of money. If you killed him there’s no way to compensate. And if only 1 from a million is wrongly accoused, it worth it to abolish death penalty.

Here here. How can the state take the moral high ground over these people if they wrongly kill people? And there is only one way to ensure you don't kill innocent people - don't kill anyone.

Also, there's no glory in being left to rot for 40 years in a concrete cell, whereas dying in a blaze of glory holds appeal for some.

The second thing is, what will be better if you kill those people, not just lock them up? Nothing. The U.S. has 4-5 times higher murder rate than us (and most european countries). And you have death penalty, we don’t. Do you really think that child rapists and serial killers will stop because they are afraid of death penalty? I don’t think so, they don’t care about it.

Comes back to gun laws: the person above mentioned the idea of buying a fully automatic AK47 with no background checks - who can really, convincingly say that's a good idea?

Over here we have incredibly strict gun laws (to the extent our Olympic shooting team cannot practice in the country - no idea what they're doing about the 2012 Olympics!). Gun crime over here is much less frequent than it is in the US, which means our Police don't have to carry guns, or need to use them as a first resort.

However, I do not agree that the sentence for murder should be 15-25 years as it is over here at the moment - life should mean you leave prison in a box (obviously, the sentencing judge should be able to use their descretion as each case is different).

As a last point - in time of war (ie the country itself is the battleground, or close to), capital punishment becomes much more acceptable (IMO), even for non-lethal crimes.

[SilverScar]

During war, when a country is the battleground, capital punisment is almost everytime equal with genocide, or mass murder of people who has other political views, and some paranoid extermination of accused spies. It’s very easy to cross the line between punishment and mass murder during a war. Ok, killing the „enemies” brings more stability, but I don’t think it worth that.