degrading ya slave

[TheDomInMe]

Originally Posted by tempered_sugar

I personally feel that there are much more affective ways to make a subbie feel their submission for instance I have to wear my collar to bed every night. This makes me aware of my submission to my Master even though he is not there. I don't personally need to be degraded or humiliated to submit to my Master I know my place because of the subtle things he does like the tone of voice he takes with me if I don't do as he says or that I am restricted on certain things. But I do agree that humiliation and degredation are different things.

Yes, humiliation, if desired by both Master and Slave, is just another tool in the Master's toolbox. It certainly is not the only tool to exert his/her power. Structure, rules, standing orders, rituals, amongst other things can also exert the Master's power and provide the Slave with a means to express his/her submission.

[SubMissChievous]

Originally Posted by TheDomInMe

I say humiliation can be used often because many things that are part of normal m/s relationships can be categorized as humiliation. For example, it could be argued that words such as slave, slut, whore, toy, pet are humiliating. It could also be argued that much of the structure that holds the m/s relationship together are humiliating - kneeling by your master, calling him Sir or Master while he/she can call you anything, performing rituals to show your worship. This is the main reason why I suggest that humiliation can be used often because it can be argued that humiliation occurs all the time in such a relationship. Degradation to me is very different from the things listed above and I do not disagree that degradation used casually can be an effective way to remind your slave of her place - my argument is against overdoing degradation for fear of the long term effects.

But then what do you do if a slave as humiliation in his/her dislikes or if it's a limit? Not all slaves want it or need it to know their place or feel owned. And I understand what you mean by having to use words like Sir or Master or kneeling can be seen as humiliating. But the thing is that what's humiliating for one isn't necessarily for all. Most of the "classics" in humiliation to me like kneeling isn't humiliating, it's just boring. But another person could see this as very humilating. And if it's a dislike much less a limit & you use it often you will have just the same nasty long-term effects in the long run. Which is why it's better to know how comfortable a slave is with humiliation before using it frequently.

And about rituals, I have never come across a slave who had them & found them humiliating. These are usually used for slaves to feel "safe" or reassured. It's to have these comforting little things "outside" the relationship in our every day life. So if it brings a negative feeling (as it would if the slave hates humiliation) then it sure don't bring any comfort or safety at all.

[TheDomInMe]

Originally Posted by naughty_chloe

But then what do you do if a slave as humiliation in his/her dislikes or if it's a limit? Not all slaves want it or need it to know their place or feel owned. And I understand what you mean by having to use words like Sir or Master or kneeling can be seen as humiliating. But the thing is that what's humiliating for one isn't necessarily for all. Most of the "classics" in humiliation to me like kneeling isn't humiliating, it's just boring. But another person could see this as very humilating. And if it's a dislike much less a limit & you use it often you will have just the same nasty long-term effects in the long run. Which is why it's better to know how comfortable a slave is with humiliation before using it frequently.

And about rituals, I have never come across a slave who had them & found them humiliating. These are usually used for slaves to feel "safe" or reassured. It's to have these comforting little things "outside" the relationship in our every day life. So if it brings a negative feeling (as it would if the slave hates humiliation) then it sure don't bring any comfort or safety at all.

You've made very good points. If a Master is using humiliation when the slave has that as a limit then there is something wrong unless he/she is trying to push the limit (if it's a soft limit). My argument about humiliation assumed a desire from both parties for humiliation and does not account for the case when one party does not desire it.

[EDIT] On my original post, I stated what I considered to be the difference of humiliation and degradation (humiliation tears down, but builds up while degradation simply breaks down). This difference is the main reason why I stated that humiliation can be used often - I was not stating that it should always be used often. Humiliation, because of the effects it can have on a sub who wants it, can help build them up over time by allowing them to express their submission without having adverse emotional effects. So for that type of sub and master, it can/should be used often. On the other hand, degradation, used repeatedly, often and over a long period of time, can harm the slave emotionally even if he/she does not realize it initially. Again, I'm using the word "can" as this may not be the case for every situation.

[gidget]

I will have to agree with TheDomInMe, of course in subjects such as these, there will always be a certain amount of personal preference.

As a sub, I am weary of degradation and its very possible dangers. While I understand subs need to be put in place sometimes and deserve punishment for disobedience, some Doms will overuse degradation as punishment, twisting my emotions for them into fear and distrust, even anger. I'd warn any master using degradation for punishment to know the strength of your slaves psyche and temperment. We like to be walked on, not stomped on. :P

[Bandit|Queen]

gidget I have to say that was a the best arnswer except I wouldnt call submitting being walked over but meh I get what you mean

[guppi2008]

Gidget you are very good at explaining things and making people think that bit more. Gave you some rep points.

[gidget]

Aw, thanks tempered_sugar and guppi~ I would've thanked you sooner, but I didn't realize my post had been commented on, oops...^ ^;

[TensionRoom101]

As a Dom, I have absolutely no desire to degrade my subs. To degrade another Human Spirit degrades the abuser tenfold.

My subs are often humiliated, agreed, but invariably it is humiliation they've brought on themselves by attempting to cause one reaction in me and ending up with egg on their face. Any humiliation from me is passive, not directive.

I KNOW the depths my sub will WILLINGLY go to to prove her devotion to me. So why do I need to put her there? To me, it is an inverse thing. She would do this for me, so I should raise her up, not raze her to the ground.

Mike