On Platonic Love
Happy Valentine’s Day everyone. It’s a sobering holiday for the singles…or potentially empowering, depending on how much you’ve kept up with the changing times. Regardless, it’s a good excuse to eat chocolate, and the after-holiday sales will certainly find me stocking up on sweets.
Note: This can be extended to all people. Can anyone form a platonic relationship with someone they are attracted to/find beautiful/etc? For the purposes of this entry, I focus on men and women since that’s what I’ve had experience with (and what the journal in reference addresses)
For the topic today, I want to talk about friendships. After recently reading a journal on Fetlife titled, “Ladies, the White Knights won't like me saying this, but you deserve the truth” (Article) by Master_James, I got to thinking about the friendships I’ve shared in life, and how they might have been influenced by this dynamic. For those who don’t have the time or care to read, the article essentially argues that men are incapable of forming a platonic friendship with women they are attracted to and that women should learn to be more skeptical when forming friendships because of that phenomenon.
There’s a part of me who instantly wants to bellow out: “Men aren’t so shallow! There are plenty of women-loving men that I’ve formed platonic friendships with. And I’m far from ugly, in looks or in personality.” However, as I look back, I realize that many of my male friends were sexually attracted to me, and they did think about dating me or having sex with me. Being close friends, some even had the guts to tell me about their feelings in person. One such day, my friend even told me that he believes it’s “impossible to just be platonic friends.”
Supposedly, according to the journal, some males (the puppy-dogs) form friendships with naïve and far too trusting females with the hope that someday they will be able to have sex with said female. When all hope of sex dissolves and when intentions become clear, these “puppy-dogs” become angry. It’s where the “friendzone” seems to come in. People go into a friendship expecting (almost with the notion that they deserve it for the time they put into the friendship) something more, and they don’t get it.
For many reasons, this really grinds my gears. Chatting, spending time together, sharing common interests. That’s what attracts me to people. That’s what makes me yell “LET’S BE FRIENDS”. This concept, even theory if you will, makes me falter a bit. It makes me doubt the integrity of my past friendships with men, let alone anyone. It makes me think to myself: “Am I really as friendly as I thought? If so, why don’t I have more female friends? Have my male friends befriended me because they some ulterior motive in mind?” It’s a blow to my ego, my pride, and my self-worth.
Yet, I can’t help but wonder what it feels like for these men. Is it so crippling? Does such a phenomenon even exist? Some of my male friends visibly and tangibly seem to fight some odd carnal urge to accept the presence of my vagina, going so far as to deny its existence. If I’m “male”, they think to themselves, then maybe they can avoid thinking of about me sexually. Maybe then we could have a truly platonic friendship, they say. What an off taste on my tongue.
Despite this, does it matter in the end? We’re friends. Being friends means that they’ll respect my desires to be nothing more than friends. If they never act out their urges, what’s the point? I suppose I want to know opinions. I was once told that men and women are still both human and that we humans all seem to share some common cerebral mindset. If I, as a female, can form platonic friendships with people I find attractive, can’t men too?
Would it be so naïve of me to believe that there are people out there who yearn for a simple friendship? In my naivety, I can only hope.
Any thoughts? Do you agree that people can’t form platonic relationships with others they are attracted to? Disagree?
Text to speech version: Audio-inclined? Click me!
Imagine a little man with a very large and very long penis. His dream is to become a helicopter, so every day he trains his penis to spin as fast and as furious as a helicopter. He even built a helicopter pad in his expansive yard, in the hopes that he might one day succeed. After years of hard work, that day finally comes. He whips up his penis and revs it into gear, cocking his legs for lift off. One attempt. Two. And he lifts off from the ground. To this day, he still flies through the air and travels the world with his penis-copter. Some days, if you listen very closely, you can hear him off in the distance, going “soi soi soi soi soi soi soi soi.”
My Roflcoptr goes Soi Soi Soi
Note: This can be extended to all people. Can anyone form a platonic relationship with someone they are attracted to/find beautiful/etc? For the purposes of this entry, I focus on men and women since that’s what I’ve had experience with (and what the journal in reference addresses)
For the topic today, I want to talk about friendships. After recently reading a journal on Fetlife titled, “Ladies, the White Knights won't like me saying this, but you deserve the truth” (Article) by Master_James, I got to thinking about the friendships I’ve shared in life, and how they might have been influenced by this dynamic. For those who don’t have the time or care to read, the article essentially argues that men are incapable of forming a platonic friendship with women they are attracted to and that women should learn to be more skeptical when forming friendships because of that phenomenon.
There’s a part of me who instantly wants to bellow out: “Men aren’t so shallow! There are plenty of women-loving men that I’ve formed platonic friendships with. And I’m far from ugly, in looks or in personality.” However, as I look back, I realize that many of my male friends were sexually attracted to me, and they did think about dating me or having sex with me. Being close friends, some even had the guts to tell me about their feelings in person. One such day, my friend even told me that he believes it’s “impossible to just be platonic friends.”
Supposedly, according to the journal, some males (the puppy-dogs) form friendships with naïve and far too trusting females with the hope that someday they will be able to have sex with said female. When all hope of sex dissolves and when intentions become clear, these “puppy-dogs” become angry. It’s where the “friendzone” seems to come in. People go into a friendship expecting (almost with the notion that they deserve it for the time they put into the friendship) something more, and they don’t get it.
For many reasons, this really grinds my gears. Chatting, spending time together, sharing common interests. That’s what attracts me to people. That’s what makes me yell “LET’S BE FRIENDS”. This concept, even theory if you will, makes me falter a bit. It makes me doubt the integrity of my past friendships with men, let alone anyone. It makes me think to myself: “Am I really as friendly as I thought? If so, why don’t I have more female friends? Have my male friends befriended me because they some ulterior motive in mind?” It’s a blow to my ego, my pride, and my self-worth.
Yet, I can’t help but wonder what it feels like for these men. Is it so crippling? Does such a phenomenon even exist? Some of my male friends visibly and tangibly seem to fight some odd carnal urge to accept the presence of my vagina, going so far as to deny its existence. If I’m “male”, they think to themselves, then maybe they can avoid thinking of about me sexually. Maybe then we could have a truly platonic friendship, they say. What an off taste on my tongue.
Despite this, does it matter in the end? We’re friends. Being friends means that they’ll respect my desires to be nothing more than friends. If they never act out their urges, what’s the point? I suppose I want to know opinions. I was once told that men and women are still both human and that we humans all seem to share some common cerebral mindset. If I, as a female, can form platonic friendships with people I find attractive, can’t men too?
Would it be so naïve of me to believe that there are people out there who yearn for a simple friendship? In my naivety, I can only hope.
Any thoughts? Do you agree that people can’t form platonic relationships with others they are attracted to? Disagree?
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Text to speech version: Audio-inclined? Click me!
Imagine a little man with a very large and very long penis. His dream is to become a helicopter, so every day he trains his penis to spin as fast and as furious as a helicopter. He even built a helicopter pad in his expansive yard, in the hopes that he might one day succeed. After years of hard work, that day finally comes. He whips up his penis and revs it into gear, cocking his legs for lift off. One attempt. Two. And he lifts off from the ground. To this day, he still flies through the air and travels the world with his penis-copter. Some days, if you listen very closely, you can hear him off in the distance, going “soi soi soi soi soi soi soi soi.”
My Roflcoptr goes Soi Soi Soi
Total Comments 6
Comments
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First of all, you need to post this on fl too, I think it would reach kp, well written and stuff.
And the thing is, with loads of the guy that do this, including me,we want to just be friends, really. We love to talk to you, we want to be there for you, we laugh and we cry with you, we fall in love with you, we do stuff together, we.. Wait wut?
I always have had loads of female friends, more than male friends normally. And 90% are totally platonic and never will be more. But then there is that 10% that you just start out as friends and you grow close and finally you feel attracted to her and fall in love. I have never been in love with someone I haven't been close friends with before.
And we don't plan this this way, we really don't.Posted 02-14-2015 at 05:41 PM by Jah Brother 
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I've got to confess that,when it comes to pretty friends of the opposite sex, I do have thoughts of the sexual kind. It's not like I act on it every single time and I can have a purely platonic relationship with a good looking girl, but I can't switch my guy-brain off. It just... does things. Not always, but my mind has a mind of its own! I think that goes for most guys.Posted 02-15-2015 at 08:00 AM by drwarschauu
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Great post! Some thoughts (I have lots but don't want to bore anyone reading!). TL;DR - yeah, sometimes!
So, I think there are a couple of points I'd make - on the original question of whether men are capable of forming a platonic friendship with women they are attracted to, I would say: It depends on the man, and on the woman concerned. After all, we're not all the same. But, with that "de-generalisation" to one side, I think I'd be inclined to think about it from two fundamental points of view.
Firstly, if we are talking about a "typical" man and "typical" woman, then generally the man will be more open to have no strings attached sex. The evidence I offer to support this is 1) the more promiscuous behaviour prevalent in gay male communities (NB not saying ALL gay men, just where the "average" lies in comparison to heterosexual communities) and 2) the fact that men pay for sex much more than women do. This, to me, is pretty conclusive evidence (as if it were needed!) that "sex" is not (on average) the same for men and women. So this means that an average guy is more likely to be open to the idea of having sex with his friend, than an average woman is, and so to my mind that immediately creates an imbalance.
Secondly, I think is the issue of being able to control our desires, emotions and ego. Generally males tend to be more egocentric than females (I use the word ego here in a bit of a Freudian sense, even though I'm not a great fan of his work!) but it's to say that males tend to be more overtly competitive, driven and aggressive in pursuing things they want (think about the "traditional" masculine traits). Consequently, to successfully manage those egotistical desires (i.e. to control your desire to have sex with your hot friend) takes control (or better yet "disintegration" -google it!) of their ego, which arguably is a fairly advanced stage of self actualisation, and consequently will be more rare.
So, I would say it's definitely possible for pure friendship to exist, though is likely to occur under fairly specific conditions, and so, will make it less frequent than we might be led to believe.Posted 02-15-2015 at 08:23 AM by RobinRed
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I've been told that same thing about straight guys being incapable of platonic friendship with women, but I don't believe it, no - I know it is not true.
I've known guys who don't know how to be platonic friends with women, who come on charming, maybe even outright tell you they have no other interest in you, but eventually it comes out that they do and hopefully the worst reaction you get from them when you turn them down is they stop talking to you. I think there are a lot of those, and I also think they are terrible human beings.
I've also known guys who were what I would call a good person and want to be friends with you because they genuinely like you and your company. They may have sexual thoughts about you, but that isn't their sole interest, and when you turn them down they keep being your friend.
I think it comes down to what kind of person they are, and do they view women as human beings worthy of friendship or just sexual objects. I admit the trick is being able to tell sooner rather than later.
I don't think having sexual thoughts about someone precludes you from being able to be their friend - and I don't think that has anything to do with male or female brains. We all have sexual thoughts about people we find attractive, and sometimes we act on those, but good people won't pretend to be friends just with the intention of getting in their pants and then be assholes when it doesn't happen.
That's my take on it, anyway.
Posted 02-15-2015 at 05:58 PM by justJane
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I rather think we're friends with people because we're attracted to them whether it be personality, similarities, or even the look of them. Not to say sexually or romantically interested, but when you like someone.. isn't there bound to
be a thought or two? Especially if you think they are attractive?
I don't think sexual attraction has to
interfere with a platonic friendship.
Also, when a guy friend doesn't take advantage when you're offering tipsy favors (who you know thinks you're hot), you know you've got a good one.Posted 02-15-2015 at 09:56 PM by eivins
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Pfft *blushes* You flatter me. Also I agree. I don't believe in love at first sight, and I believe love is a process! And for me, "friendship" is a precursor to that. xDQuote:Originally Posted by Jah_BrotherFirst of all, you need to post this on fl too, I think it would reach kp, well written and stuff.
Ooh interesting! Surely, there's tons and tons of girls who have the same problem, but for some reason, people only seem to focus on guys. How unfair!Quote:Originally Posted by drwarschauuI've got to confess that,when it comes to pretty friends of the opposite sex, I do have thoughts of the sexual kind.
Thanks for your kind words, and I love the evidence-based approach you brought to your post! The points you brought up about sexual inclinations and egotistical desires are really quite interesting. You not only state an opinion, but you also explained it.Quote:Originally Posted by RobinRedFirstly, if we are talking about a "typical" man and "typical" woman, then generally the man will be more open to have no strings attached sex.
I agree! It takes a bit of wisdom and intuition to distinguish the good apples from the bad. But even if sexual thoughts do come into play, friendship means that there's a mutual respect for interests, or lack thereof.Quote:Originally Posted by justJaneI've been told that same thing about straight guys being incapable of platonic friendship with women, but I don't believe it, no - I know it is not true.
I think my guy friends who remain my guy friends even after it's established that I'm not interested are some of the best friends I have. Sometimes one will joke about getting a blowjob out of me, and we'll just laugh it off. That understanding is one that I honestly respect. xDQuote:Originally Posted by eivinsAlso, when a guy friend doesn't take advantage when you're offering tipsy favors (who you know thinks you're hot), you know you've got a good one.Posted 03-03-2015 at 11:39 PM by Clerisyberry
