Yet another World War II story with potential that was rushed. It is painful to watch non crucial story lines getting air time been under par when a fantastic story could've been over two episodes and make the series overall much better. I'd rather Have had that in two parts and jump the 'Curse Of The Black Spot'.

Been thinking a little more about why this episode jarred so much with me. The episode is called "Let's kill Hitler" Hitler is out of sight in the first 5 minutes. Why did it need to be set in Berlin?

I think we've already well established that this was clearly just Moffat filling in some back story. I think as long as Moffat is at the helm it will need to be accepted that he is going to work towards a series arc rather than entertaining individual episodes. If that's the case, why can't they be written that way. I'd be happy watching 12 episodes of a continuing theme rather than what we had this week which was a whole lot of back story crammed into one episode.

Can't have it both ways. Either make each week it's own adventure (with occasional 2 parter) or make the series one long story which wouldn't be as good in my opinion but more acceptable than having episodes like this.

On a related note Moffat is a genius at putting precursors and hints into stories. Back in Series 5 episode 4 (First part of the weeping angels story) the Doctor and Amy are walking around the delirium archive, the final resting place of the headless monks. I laughed when I heard that last night.

I agree. RTD wasn't subtle but he kept the arc in the background of all stories until the finale and then it was the main focus. This time around, it's the arc that's being thrown in our faces.

And sorry to ruin the magic but Moffat didn't plan that one; he, like RTD used to do, decided it was a fun thing to reuse and bring to life. I'm starting to feel the same with River... has he planned this well ahead, or is he making it up as he goes along?

Torchwood's seventh episode ... finally, something great. Unfortunately, this episode shows what Torchwood could've been. How good would it have been to have basically the travels of Jack throughout the 19th/20th century? Him and Angelo were really fleshed out; the whole subplot was great; it was refreshing and thought-out and... yeah. Brilliant. That said, the modern day stuff with Gwen and Jack was fantastic too. This is the best episode so far and I'm glad we're finally getting somewhere.

Nice SJA nod too :)

It's a shame to watch and think why do we have such a good episode there. And not all the way through.

Because this story didn't feature the Miracle... honestly, it's as if RTD thought of that idea and then had to stretch it to 10 episodes when, really, 5 would've done.

I think Torchwood went poor again. After thinking maybes it was just the drag and it was finally over this episode confirmed otherwise. A guy dies Jack showed no emotion. They find a plate and Morphic fields and the blessing are back! Wooooo Not enough for the full hour!

Not to mention the plotholes... the woman who wanted Jack to come over... held Gwen's family hostage in their own house... erm, why? All she had to do was ring Jack and say "come over, Angelo is here and needs you".

And the CIA are useless... didn't they notice anything suspicious while Jack and Esther and Rex were talking down by the plates? It must've looked slightly suspicious.

Also, the fat guy who blew himself up... handy that he waited until he was away from the house and in the car, away from the people who had just outed him and ruined his life...

:facepalm:

Miracle day would have been better as a two parter... It might have been a tight one but if you remove the flight to America(not important), Gwens movement( Took about five episodes and somehow the CIA didn't pick her up!?!). The Incinerations (NOt important to the plot i doubt). Moving to LA (not important). You could have had a 13 part series have the group meet up in the first. The one in Jacks past as a build up and Oswald as much a she did carry the show has now been sidelined... Bill Pullman did well again now he's back in it but i can't help but feel the acting from Kissenger is so PLASTIC!. All her movements and voices are just horrible and never fit. It has been tolerable until the scene where Oswald hits her. He did so well. The movement, the anger, the voice, the walk, the nerves. Yet she looked like some punching dumby moving a little with a tape playing in the back ground. Just my opinion. But Miracle day could have so easily have been just two episodes. The 1920s a prologue. The meeting up the opener. The American move hasn't sold me. A lot of plot holes but what has he got to do if the company is to blame for demanding it this way. If it's his idea then he should leave. Immediately. A lot of the episode have been worse than his worst Doctor Whos.
I say give it to Chris Chibnall. Wrote Countrycide the best Torchwood episode i believe, He has worked with Starz before and some of the best actors. Jamies Campbell Bower, Joseph Fiennes and Eva Green worked well with him in Camelot and under Starz. All three would be perfect replacements For the Torchwood crew. Bower the timid (bit like Ianto) Fiennes(the complicated and who mixes the whole shbang up) and Eva Green( Some fine booty that would rival Gwen and cause friction, lots of banter to work with in my opinion). That is of course me fantasying. But it would have gone better than the tripe we are been feed.

It really couldn't have been a two-parter. Five parts, maybe, as they did with CoE over five nights. It hasn't helped that it's felt dragged out, and it's been one episode a week... it's just waiting and waiting. Maybe once the DVD arrives it'll be easier to rewatch, at our own favoured pace.

Chibnall would ruin it! Let's look at his contributions to TW and DW...

"Day One" (2006) - Average
"Cyberwoman" (2006) - Terrible
"Countrycide" (2006) - Average, borderline crap
"End of Days" (2007) - Fantastic
"Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang" (2008) - 7/10, half-average, half good
"Adrift" (2008) - Great
"Fragments" (2008) - Great
"Exit Wounds" (2008) - Fantastic

"42" (2007) - Really poor
"The Hungry Earth" / "Cold Blood" (2010) - Really poor

Chibby's rather hit and miss. At least RTD at the helm gives us some consistency, even if the end result is somewhat jumbled.

RTD isn't hit and miss and i entirely disagree with your judgements of the episodes. I can't defend 42 i'll give you that but Hungry earth was let down by mostly by the Costume department.
Day One- Brilliant.
Cyberwoman- Loved it.
Countrycide- My favorite episode of Torchwood.
End of Days- Really good. Fudged ending though but again not much he could've done.
Kiss kiss, bang bang- Above Average.
Adrift- Didn't like but intresting none the less.
Fragments- The best one of Series two. Really nice to look at the past and look where they are now.
Exit Wounds- Terrific.

Fair enough :) RTD is very hit and miss though; one week he gave us "New Earth" and then he'd give us something like "Midnight".

"The Hungry Earth" wanted to be a lot of things but failed on every level. The mining operation harked back to the Pertwee era... except this one had about 5 workers. The costumes, as you say, were dreadful. The pacing was all over the place (and that's because of the direction and the writing). Three people sat around a table discussing possibilities of sharing the planet on behalf of the entire human race? And such an important scene brushed off in a montage of about 20 seconds? The bad writing; how can we make this epic... oooh, yeah, let's have an ominous voiceover/narration.

It was all a poor show.

"Cyberwoman" was dreadful. Firstly there's no logic in the Cyberwoman... absolutely none of the Cybermen had breasts; I don't care if they were down to using spare parts, a woman like that would not have been converted like that. It was basically a shoddy excuse to do "oooh something different" and it was crap. Represented what Torchwood wanted to be; it wanted to be dark and new and adult. Instead, it was just shock!horror!OMG! and plain wrong. Plus, aside from the Cyberwoman... you've got the pithy fight scenes, Torchwood who have no idea she's even down there, and *terrible* acting all-round (but mostly from Gareth as Ianto breaks down... into completely awful acting).

"Countrycide", again, wanted to be dark and adult. Instead, it was blood and gore for the hell of it. Torchwood is dark, so, wheeeyyy, let's make it actually dark and bloody and horrific and, yeah, let's just go to that stereotype and not actually make Torchwood 'adult'. (Torchwood doing 'adult' right is basically CoE.)

The rest we pretty much agree on. But, those three episodes aside, it's still not a list of top-rating stories.

What or who do you suppose is the solution? Because the series will just be axed if another series falls by nearly two million views.

Just kind of realised / remebered. Mr. hitler had a medical condition in 1938 which he picked up from World war I. He Had Parkinson's. Yet no sign of that in the production.