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My view on punishments

Posted 04-15-2019 at 01:29 PM by Butterfly
Updated 04-15-2019 at 02:16 PM by Butterfly

I am pretty sure that I have blogged about a similar topic in the past, but talking to a friend recently, I had a few points come up that I thought I wanted to get written out to share with others.

Punishment vs. Funishment
First of all, I want to state that I take punishments very seriously, both as a Domme and a sub. I know that a lot of people like, what I call, funishments. This is the fantasy of being "punished" or in trouble and being subjected to something like spanking or corner time, but in reality the sub and dom both really enjoy those things and it gets them off or gives them pleasure in some way. In my dynamics, I don't use funishments.

Some of my likes as a sub might be considered traditional punishments. For example, I really love spanking. However, I don't want to pretend that I am in trouble, or try to get myself into trouble so that I can be spanked. I would much prefer to have my D type just spank me for fun.

As a sub, the worst thing about a punishment is knowing that I have disappointed my D type. If I was told that having an orgasm was a punishment, even thought it is something that I love, I would have a very hard time completing it because I know that I have let my person down. And I think that is the biggest difference between a punishment and funishment.

As a Domme, I can be rather sadistic at times. I subject my sub (and play partners) to pain and other "torture" because it pleases me and/or them. I don't consider this a punishment. They are suffering for my pleasure. Using the word punishment would indicate that they did something wrong to deserve that treatment. In reality it is the opposite. When they do this, I am so incredibly happy and proud.

Consequence vs. Punishment
I also think there is a difference between a consequence and a punishment.

I believe that if a rule is broken accidentally, or if a deadline is missed because of outside circumstances beyond the subs control, the sub should not receive a punishment. However, it may be appropriate for them to receive a consequence.

On the other hand, if a sub deliberately disobeys a rule or order for no other reason than "I didn't want to", that calls for a punishment.

I do have to admit that I am very strict as a Domme. If a casual play partner decided that they were just going to ignore my instructions without discussing it with me or using a safeword, I would be very likely to consider "releasing" them. This is not because I think they are a failure or a bad sub, but it is because my authority obviously means nothing to them.

Communication for me is the most important part of any relationship, and I am very fair. If my sub or casual play partner do not come to me to discuss their concerns and negotiate an alternative, or if they do not indicate that they cannot complete something by using their safeword, I expect them to at least attempt my orders. If they are then not able to complete it for whatever reason, we can discuss whether a consequence is fitting. I only ever expect my subs to try their best, they are not expected to be perfect.

For example, if a sub is in denial and has a wet dream, I am not going to punish them. This is something that they cannot control at all. Their body made that decision completely on its own. If that same sub was asked to complete 5 edges and they accidentally had an orgasm or ruined orgasm, then I would likely give a consequence as they should have been able to stop sooner, but they didn't do it on purpose. Lastly, if that sub said to themselves "fuck it, I want to cum" and then proceeded to do so, they would receive a severe punishment and/or the relationship would be terminated.

Choosing the right consequence/punishment
I believe that the consequence or punishment should fit the crime. I also believe that punishments are very personalized to each individual sub.

For me, as a sub, just knowing that I disappointed somebody that I care for is enough of a punishment. The actual act of a consequence or punishment isn't even needed. I beat myself up enough. However, completing a punishment can be cleansing. It serves as a penance so that I can complete the punishment and then wipe the slate clean and move on.

Consequences and punishments should not include things from a subs like list. They should be things that they do not enjoy doing. Choosing something painful for a sub who loves pain is not going to get the message across. However, it is also important to remember that punishments should still not cross limits. Limits are limits for a reason.

As a Domme, I don't enjoy giving punishment. As stated previously, I can be sadistic and I love seeing my sub suffer, but having to give my sub a consequence or punishment is not fun for me. Knowing that it is a punishment puts a damper on the task. Therefore I make sure to choose things that I don't particularly enjoy either.

For example, with Jaro, I love to make him do squats and hold them. I love watching his trembling legs, and hear him call out in pain. I know that he hates to do them, but he does them purely for my pleasure. I don't choose this as a punishment or consequence, instead I choose something like corner time or lines. Those things do nothing for me, and nothing for him so they work great.

I believe that when choosing a punishment, you should choose something that the sub can easily complete. Punishments and consequences are supposed to reinforce that the behavior is unwanted. Choosing something like a mantra that needs to be repeated while doing jumping jacks, or writing out lines, or maybe even sitting in a corner and reflecting on what they did are all good ways to get that message across. If you choose something that they might not be able to successfully complete, it is going to send the wrong message to the sub. Setting them up for failure is never ok in my books.

I feel that consequences related to the offence are most effective. For example, when Jaro missed a deadline for a task, I increased the difficulty of the task so it would take more of his time and then gave him a new deadline. Another example was a punishment that I received for saying naughty words during little time. I had to write 5 lines in crayon that said "I will not use naughty words". Both were very effective at delivering the right message without being overly harsh or unattainable.

I am also a believer that timing is really important when it comes to punishment. Some suspense or waiting period can be tactfully done to increase anticipation, but delaying the punishment or making it carry on for days or weeks can sometimes be harmful.

Communication and Aftercare
I don't think that consequences require as much aftercare, but it is still important to discuss the reasons behind the consequence. As I stated, as a sub, I immediately go to a bad place when I feel as though I fucked up. I start to think that I am a failure and that I am not worthy. Knowing that they fell short of the expectations you hold them to is important to a certain extent, but reassurance afterwards is very important.

I think that aftercare becomes really important after a severe punishment. Again, I feel like punishments can be cathartic as both parties can feel like it is wiping the slate clean. Communication around the offence, the punishment and the new expectations going forward are all very important.

The sub should completely understand what they did wrong. If they do not feel the punishment or consequence is warranted, it will never have the intended affect. It should be clearly explained what the offence was, and why they deserve a consequence or punishment.

When the punishment is over, a debriefing can be very helpful, especially if the sub is like me and goes to that negative head space. Some people believe that reassurance after a punishment is counterproductive. However, as both a sub and Domme, I feel as though when the punishment is complete, you can drop the "business like" attitude and embrace your sub (with words if not in person) and work on moving forward.

It is also very important to have an honest conversation about expectations going forward, and allowing your sub to share their feelings, thoughts and ask questions.

One last note
One last thing I wanted to mention kind of swings back around to the topic of funishments. If a sub is deliberately breaking rules or disobeying to earn punishments, this is a sign that communication needs to happen.

In my opinion this means that the sub either doesn't respect you or your authority or they are not being open about their needs and wants. If they want harsher tasks, if they want funishments, or to be challenged, etc. then this needs to be discussed and negotiated.

Baiting a Dom to punish you because you enjoy it is exhausting for both parties and neither will feel happy or fulfilled.
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Comments

  1. Old Comment
    Peachybaby's Avatar
    Wow this is very well stated! I enjoy the topic as well! I agree you should never set a sub up for failure and give them an unreasonable task!! Seems like you’re an amazing Sub and Domme ♥️
    Posted 04-15-2019 at 02:01 PM by Peachybaby Peachybaby is offline
  2. Old Comment
    LitDarkness's Avatar
    PeachBaby, she does seem like she is amazing in both regards.

    And yes, don't set up your sub to fail, that is never going to turn out well.

    No one likes failing.

    Even though we seem to have some diffrent domming styles on this, (I will excuse real life without any consequences in most cases for example.) I think this is a good blog to learn from.
    Posted 04-15-2019 at 02:49 PM by LitDarkness LitDarkness is offline
  3. Old Comment
    Butterfly's Avatar
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by LitDarkness View Comment
    PeachBaby, she does seem like she is amazing in both regards.

    And yes, don't set up your sub to fail, that is never going to turn out well.

    No one likes failing.

    Even though we seem to have some diffrent domming styles on this, (I will excuse real life without any consequences in most cases for example.) I think this is a good blog to learn from.
    Thank you for the compliment.

    Oh, I am not always super strict when it comes to real life. For example, if I assign a task for Jaro to complete by the end of the week and then he gets sick or he has visitors or he is even just busy and stressed, then we can talk about changing the deadline without any consequence. However, if he had 2 weeks and was just being lazy so he put it off and then forgot ... he is going to have a consequence. But neither circumstance would warrant a punishment.
    Posted 04-15-2019 at 02:54 PM by Butterfly Butterfly is offline
  4. Old Comment
    onemoretime83's Avatar
    bleh the line on aftercare is pretty spot on, don't know how many times that's broken up a hot session after the fact. It's a pretty rough psychological warp to do dirty things and then to just sit and feel weird after.
    Posted 04-15-2019 at 04:30 PM by onemoretime83 onemoretime83 is offline
  5. Old Comment
    Consensus's Avatar
    Insightful! I'm still new to all of this, or, rather, newer than I had assumed. As a consequence, this was very much what I needed to read. Thank you for it! Especially the part on feeling like you failed your Dom and that being punishment enough, so that the consequence is a penance that helps with the guilt! Yes! So much yes!

    Thank you for writing this!

    Connie
    Posted 04-15-2019 at 08:24 PM by Consensus Consensus is offline
  6. Old Comment
    creativekink's Avatar
    Very sexy to read. You have this firmness with your tone that it so hot. Anyway great blog as usual. People getting punishments on purpose are some of my early red flag warnings.
    Posted 04-16-2019 at 07:30 AM by creativekink creativekink is offline
  7. Old Comment
    Jaro's Avatar
    I can attest to Miss Butterfly being very fair and just when it comes to punishments.
    She rarely punishes me and when she does, I really do deserve it.

    We do do funishments sometimes but we don't call them that. I get spanked because it's fun!

    Great blog Miss!
    Posted 04-16-2019 at 11:14 AM by Jaro Jaro is online now
  8. Old Comment
    Butterfly's Avatar
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jaro View Comment
    I can attest to Miss Butterfly being very fair and just when it comes to punishments.
    She rarely punishes me and when she does, I really do deserve it.

    We do do funishments sometimes but we don't call them that. I get spanked because it's fun!

    Great blog Miss!
    I don't know that I would call what we do "funishments", only because to me, "funishments" are when you are pretending that you were bad and want to do a role play of a punishment just because it is fun.

    We just do spanking because we like it.
    Posted 04-16-2019 at 11:19 AM by Butterfly Butterfly is offline
  9. Old Comment
    Little.Alexis's Avatar
    I love the blog and wanted to share some thoughts as I have been on the receiving end of some really bad punishments. I am a firm believe that a punishment shouldn't be fun or something the submissive would want. That would defeat the purpose of the punishment. But, it should be quick and doable for the submissive. The submissive should be forgiven at the end and probably have cuddles or something. Long punishments or ones that can't be done by the s'type will only deter confessions of future issues. For me, the worst punishment would not be physical in nature. Rather being told that I let them down and disappointing my D'type. Whatever punishment they decided would be bad but... not as bad as knowing that I failed them.

    The only thing I really disagree with the blog is the dismissal of the submissive. It takes two for a sub to act up and a severe conversation would be needed to rectify the issue. Unless it is a repetitive thing and there hasn't been an improvement. I do believe that a severe punishment would be merited as long as it was manageable by the s'type. Maybe dismissal of the sub if the D'type thinks the s'type isn't going to put any effort into fixing the issue.

    I personally believe that punishments are there to change behavior and keep the s'type in line with what the D'type is wanting. Aftercare and above all... rewards for good behavior are absolutely necessary. Rewards are significantly better at changing behavior then any kind of punishment.

    These are just my opinion

    - little alexis
    Posted 04-16-2019 at 04:40 PM by Little.Alexis Little.Alexis is offline
  10. Old Comment
    Butterfly's Avatar
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Little.Alexis View Comment

    The only thing I really disagree with the blog is the dismissal of the submissive. It takes two for a sub to act up and a severe conversation would be needed to rectify the issue. Unless it is a repetitive thing and there hasn't been an improvement. I do believe that a severe punishment would be merited as long as it was manageable by the s'type. Maybe dismissal of the sub if the D'type thinks the s'type isn't going to put any effort into fixing the issue.
    I just want to clarify that I did say that if it was a casual play partner who disobeyed with no other reason than "I don't want to", they would likely be "released". I know that Dommes aren't very plentiful around here, and I am also a very busy person. I honestly don't have the time and patience for somebody who doesn't respect my authority.

    That being said, if they have a conversation with me, and they let me know what the problem is, then there is always room for negotiation and second chances.

    Of course, with long term play partners, like Jaro, there would be a LOT more flexibility and communication. I know that if Jaro did something without safewording or talking to me, then something is really going on. I would be worried and take the time to figure it out with him. However, I will say that Jaro has been punished before for not communicating his feelings to IceMaiden and I.

    I hope this clears that up a bit.

    I am strict, but I am also very fair.
    Posted 04-16-2019 at 08:44 PM by Butterfly Butterfly is offline
  11. Old Comment
    Emmyred's Avatar
    This is beautiful. I think we need to clarify the meaning of the word “punishment” in this community, and you’ve described it perfectly.
    Posted 04-17-2019 at 05:18 AM by Emmyred Emmyred is online now
  12. Old Comment
    Lemuricon's Avatar
    I fully agree with your writeup and feelings towards the topic.
    Breakin rules intentionally is not a good wait to fish for play.
    If you want to push domme a bit, there is always bratting etc ...
    Posted 04-17-2019 at 08:58 AM by Lemuricon Lemuricon is offline
  13. Old Comment
    MastersVoice's Avatar
    Okay, I'm a bit late to the party here it seems. As usual Butterfly, you have a superb handle on the theme you write about! I agree with pretty much everything you say and my outlook on punishments mirrors yours totally. I actually dislike giving them and like you said if a sub is willfully disobedient then there's probably something a little deeper under the skin of the relationship that needs addressing/talking about.

    The only thing I would add is a punishment doesn't always have to be the act of doing something it can also be the act of removing a pleasure for a set time too.

    Great post as always, sorry I'm so late in responding!

    X X X
    Posted 04-17-2019 at 01:28 PM by MastersVoice MastersVoice is offline
  14. Old Comment
    Little.Alexis's Avatar
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Butterfly View Comment
    I just want to clarify that I did say that if it was a casual play partner who disobeyed with no other reason than "I don't want to", they would likely be "released". I know that Dommes aren't very plentiful around here, and I am also a very busy person. I honestly don't have the time and patience for somebody who doesn't respect my authority.

    That being said, if they have a conversation with me, and they let me know what the problem is, then there is always room for negotiation and second chances...
    That actually does make sense as it could be a red flag or an indicator of some extra work. Even a Dom(me) could make a mistake that would lead me to leave and find another person. I personally have a 3 strike rule for a Dom(me) and will leave at the 3rd unless we have had some time together or they are honest mistakes that are not related. Also, it is about perspective as honest mistakes are very different from blatant disregard for the other person. Like when I had a Dom blackmail me and then I left as a result. Then an honest mistake like someone asking me to do something that was a limit and then instantly taking it back.

    Thank you sooooo much for the clarification and hope I didn't upset you or anything. Though I tend to worry myself to death.

    -little alexis
    Posted 04-18-2019 at 08:48 PM by Little.Alexis Little.Alexis is offline
 

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