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Old 01-17-2017, 01:35 AM   #31
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I understand what you are saying, but.

I do not want her to become my slave. I want her to find out what she likes in sex. And then, I wanna offer that to her. So, if after some time (months, years, I do not know) finds out she likes being my slave, then yes, I would offer her that.

But her being my slave/submissive is not what I want right now. I want her to open up more, relax, and have more fun.

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Originally Posted by iSpuds View Post
I don't like to hand out advice in one-sided situations; I don't know anything about your partner aside from what you've written here. I don't know her perspective. However, one little snippet of your description stuck out for me, and I think it's worth addressing:



For many people, four months isn't nearly enough time to build the kind of trust it takes to obediently take orders from someone. Especially if the two of you didn't meet in the context of BDSM (i.e. on a fetish site or D/s site where you are both anticipating a Dom/sub relationship), I wouldn't expect her to fall into the role that easily. From what you're describing, it doesn't sound like you're terribly experienced with one another, and I'm not sure that "obedience" is a very realistic goal for you right now.

Build upon trust, openness, and, on your part, strong leadership skills - obedience will follow.
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Old 01-17-2017, 03:02 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by msesi View Post
About your question: Why?
I have this feeling that deep inside she feels like sex, or whatever we are doing, is BAD in some sense. And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian). I asked her recently for a photo of her pussy and her response was: No, I am not gonna do it. I asked her why, and she replied because it is not appropriate.

I am really "afraid" to talk about sex because she gets upset. WE have argued 4 times till we met, and it was always about sex. If you ask me, all four times for silly reasons. o I don't really look forward to starting a conversation like that again, especially if the topic is BDSM, or master-slave or whatever. I am afraid if she listens the word slave for example, or see some more "extreme" kinks, she might lose completely interest in all activities of bdsm (like spanking, bondage) that she enjoys (a loot).

It is quite obvious to me that she likes being dominated but "under conditions". For example, she loves being tied, but only if I fuck her while being tied. She does not let me for example tie her and play with her pussy or spank her. But she does let me tie her, fuck her and spank her at the same time. Or play with her pussy while not being tied. And these things somehow confuse me. Do I do something wrong? Am I pushing her too much?

The best thing I can do is to keep doing to her only what I know she likes. Wait for some time before trying or suggesting new things. And I will also keep trying to have a conversation with her about sex. About what she likes and what she doesn't. But when I do try to do that, her response is: I do not know what I like, or, I just do not like that, or, it is not appropriate.
Ok, I can't believe that no one didn't kill the elephant in the room yet. First off, I don't believe that everybody on the board is Muslin, Jewish, or Hindu, so don't blame it on her religion. (And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian))

Next when you went down on her for the first time, did she say, oh, I love that, and then next on the 2nd and 3rd time pushed your head down in that direction. Then on the 4th, she said NO. Just clear that up for me, I want to hear the whole story about that.

As for the spanking she won't let you put her over the knee, but you spank her while having sex. Afterwards, did you ask her, did you like that? Clear that up too, before I recommend that you end the relationship.

Now this is going to sound crazy to you. In this world, action can be either, action or lack of action, which is still an action, and the same goes for words too. Sometimes the loudest scream is silence.
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Old 01-17-2017, 03:55 AM   #33
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MasterMichaelNY,

With all due respect, you have posted the more replies in this thread and yet helped me the least.
I think you have a talent in distorting my sayings, and not even trying to understand what I am saying. Or my English is terrible. Or your understanding of English is terrible. Or you just want to be the one who kills the elephant and not really want to help.

I 'll try for the last time to reply to your comments.

First of all, I am not blaming, as you say, anything at her religion. I absolutely respect her religion (I am a Christian myself by the way). I am just saying: It might be what blocks her mind in some situations.

Second, about going down on her. The first time I tried she said no, I do not really enjoy it. Then the second time she let me do it and she almost had an orgasm. Then I went down again but she told me to stop after some while. And one week ago she actually asked for it, without me trying to go there. THAT is what I mean, something is blocking her from enjoying some things in sex. I cannot make it any clearer than that. Sorry.

Third, about spanking. She LOVES being spanked while I fuck her. She ASKS for it. I do not just spank her, without her wanting it. How many times do I have to say I will never do anything to her she does not want? How many times? I am just wondering why she likes it only during intercourse and not before, or after.

Fourth, I am not completely clueless about bdsm. And most importantly, I am a (highly, if I may say so for myself) intelligent person. So, no, it does not sound crazy when you say that taking no action, is an action. I understand that.
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Old 01-17-2017, 05:13 AM   #34
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How am I distorting you sayings, did you say this, Yes or No. (And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian))

That's it, i'm done.
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Old 01-17-2017, 05:21 AM   #35
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I said this:

I have this feeling that deep inside she feels like sex, or whatever we are doing, is BAD in some sense. And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian). I asked her recently for a photo of her pussy and her response was: No, I am not gonna do it. I asked her why, and she replied because it is not appropriate.

Not just this:
And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian).

There is a difference if you keep just one sentence from someone's sayings.
That is distortion. You take one sentence from a whole argument or statement or whatever, ignoring the rest of it, and making your own assumptions.

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How am I distorting you sayings, did you say this, Yes or No. (And that is probably originating from her religion (Christian))
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Old 01-17-2017, 12:57 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by msesi View Post
I understand what you are saying, but.

I do not want her to become my slave. I want her to find out what she likes in sex. And then, I wanna offer that to her. So, if after some time (months, years, I do not know) finds out she likes being my slave, then yes, I would offer her that.

But her being my slave/submissive is not what I want right now. I want her to open up more, relax, and have more fun.
Honestly, the same qualities that create the foundation for a good BDSM relationship are the same qualities that create the foundation of any good relationship. Therefore, whether you're wanting her to be your slave or not, I maintain that providing a space where openness and trust are able to build is probably the best thing for you right now.

Like some others have mentioned, it is important to talk about these things while not being influenced by arousal. It may be awkward, but sitting down at a table and asking her, "What are you interested in sexually?" may be the best way for you to find out exactly what it is she wants.

And then bear in mind that even if she details everything she'd be interested in, there is a huge difference between talking about it in theory and then being faced with the opportunity. She may get cold feet at the last minute, or she may become anxious, or she may decide she doesn't like the thing after all. In my mind, if I were faced with any of those scenarios, my next step would be to openly discuss what she needs to feel comfortable with an activity, or if there's nothing that would make her want to do it again, consider avoiding the activity altogether.

As for your pussy eating example, upon seeing this thread my pet mentioned that, if she randomly rejects you trying to lick her pussy, maybe she's feeling anxious and self-conscious about the taste and smell, or maybe she's on her period. If that's the case, my pet suggests trying to play in the shower or bath (note: don't tell her to take a shower, that would confirm her anxiety; simply offer to take a shower with her and initiate some "naughty time" there).

My pet's advice aside, it's important for you (and most men) to understand that women can be very self-conscious about their vaginas. From personal experience, there are a number of things that would make me not want to be eaten out, from not having had a shower yet to just the random anxiety or self-deprecation. So, if she doesn't want your face in intimate places, I wouldn't take it personally.
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:19 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msesi View Post
Would you think that it would be better talking with her at a neutral ground -eg while drinking a coffee- or during/before/after sex. I have a feeling she might has her "defences" more down while we are at bed. And the problem is that almost all the times we start talking about sex, we have an argument at the end.
I wish I had a simple answer for you here, but I don't think there's one that would cover every case-- because different people are different. I'd try to make sure not to put too much pressure on her, in either case. If you ask something, and she seems to not know or take a while thinking about it-- I'd explicitly offer more time, or ask that she take some time, to think it over.

As mentioned above, there are all sorts of reasons someone would be willing sometimes, but not all of the time. Working out appropriate times to do this sort of stuff may be useful. It doesn't have to be a strict schedule-- but surprises aren't always appreciated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by msesi View Post
I understand what you are saying, but.
I do not want her to become my slave. I want her to find out what she likes in sex. And then, I wanna offer that to her. So, if after some time (months, years, I do not know) finds out she likes being my slave, then yes, I would offer her that.

But her being my slave/submissive is not what I want right now. I want her to open up more, relax, and have more fun.
From what you've said so far, I'd still think of her as just a person who likes some things, rather than a "submissive." You may want to make sure you're wanting to help her with more than just sex. (which, on a related note: is she comfortable with more vanilla sex?)

Quote:
It is quite obvious to me that she likes being dominated but "under conditions". For example, she loves being tied, but only if I fuck her while being tied. She does not let me for example tie her and play with her pussy or spank her. But she does let me tie her, fuck her and spank her at the same time. Or play with her pussy while not being tied. And these things somehow confuse me. Do I do something wrong? Am I pushing her too much?
[QUOTE=iSpuds;2623437]Honestly, the same qualities that create the foundation for a good BDSM relationship are the same qualities that create the foundation of any good relationship. Therefore, whether you're wanting her to be your slave or not, I maintain that providing a space where openness and trust are able to build is probably the best thing for you right now.

Like some others have mentioned, it is important to talk about these things while not being influenced by arousal. It may be awkward, but sitting down at a table and asking her, "What are you interested in sexually?" may be the best way for you to find out exactly what it is she wants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by msesi View Post
It is quite obvious to me that she likes being dominated but "under conditions". For example, she loves being tied, but only if I fuck her while being tied. She does not let me for example tie her and play with her pussy or spank her. But she does let me tie her, fuck her and spank her at the same time. Or play with her pussy while not being tied. And these things somehow confuse me. Do I do something wrong? Am I pushing her too much?
I'd be careful to assume that wanting to be told what to do, asking you to eat her out, or allowing other things you've asked her to do indicates that she actually likes those things. Even if she is a "submissive," not all like/want sexual things-- but will often tolerate/pursue it to please their partner. Even more so if you keep pressuring her to try new things, she may avoid saying things in fear of displeasing you.

Which goes back to: what has actually been communicated? Your intent to try new sexual things? Your intent to only do things she likes? Things she actually likes, rather than just things she accept to make you happier?
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:31 PM   #38
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So a couple things...

Spanking during sex and not any other time: It might be that it helps her when having sex. Spanking without the distraction or pleasure of sex may be off putting for her. Also spanking with say your hand during sex, I can imagine feels differently than if I was just put over someones knee as a punishment for example. So with that as an example, there are many things that have different contexts.

Did you ever consider that by going down on her, she feels she has to turn around and give you head? That might be part of her defense. She might feel guilty if you go down on her and she doesn't do the same. She might be shy about herself and in the end there is nothing you can really do to change that besides supporting her and complimenting her, because she has to see her self worth and beauty before she will believe you. An idea might be, buy her a simple tiny vibrator and let her know its for whenever she wants to play around and see what she likes and that you will never interrupt her private time unless she wants you to. It might get her more comfortable with her vagina and herself.

You say you already know the fight is going to end in an argument, but you love her. It is not healthy to fight about the same topic. It is not healthy to be pushing aside your desires for her all the time. In fact it might make her feel like more of a burden instead of being something for her. Whether you choose to accept the reality of it or not, MasterMichaelNY is correct. If it is not working, you need to make the mature choice to talk to her about it or you need to decide if the relationship is worth it. You might love her and want her happiness, but it is not worth torturing yourself.

Argument or not, you need to talk to her. Before you talk to her though set up some I care about you and didnt want to fight but we needed to talk surprises for when she's sad. This could be as simple as her favorite ice cream in the freezer, chocolate on her pillow, even a coupon for one night of you sleeping on the couch (depending if you live together or not). That is a way to acknowledge one of the worse case scenarios for the situation, but letting her know you still care. Secondly, as hard as it is in an argument, let her yell and scream and get angry, but keep calm and relaxed and let her know you just want to know how to make her happy. Know when to back away. As a girl (I am saying it because I am one and stereotypically I see this all the time) we will drag you back into an argument, we will try to make you feel bad, and we will make carefully calculated moves to hurt you in as many ways as possible. We do not often mean it, we are just angry so we choose to find ways to hurt you. Just stay calm and know that she's going to be a storm before she can calm down sometimes, but also do not push her in a discussion if you can avoid it. If you feel an argument coming on, then stop or redirect the conversation. If you want to make it work, you have to communicate her and you cannot avoid this conversation.
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:43 PM   #39
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I wish I had a simple answer for you here, but I don't think there's one that would cover every case-- because different people are different. I'd try to make sure not to put too much pressure on her, in either case. If you ask something, and she seems to not know or take a while thinking about it-- I'd explicitly offer more time, or ask that she take some time, to think it over.
I got some really useful responses from you and some other people here, and thank you for the time and effort you took in replying.

I do not want to put pressure on her, I do not want her to feel uncomfortable or whatever. I am just confused by some of her reactions and not being an experienced person in such matters I do not know how to interpret them. That is why I asked for some help/advice.

To make this clear. Our sexual life started absolutely vanilla. We both had fun that way. I never even imagined that she had a "kinkier" or whatever is called (I hate labels) side. Then at some point she told me that I can do whatever I want with her, which kinda surprised me, and I am still trying to figure out what it means. My best guess, is that she told me in her own way that she likes "following" me in sex. Then after some time, she told me she likes two things I do not do to her: spanking, and pulling her hair. So I started doing those things and she indeed loves them. Then bondage also came into play (I am sorry but I cannot remember exactly how) and now we are experimenting also with that. Moreover, in the process I am describing above, I was gaining more "control" during sex, and both she and I love that. I started talking dirty to her, telling what to do and what not to do and in general giving her orders: Go on your knees, play with your pussy, whatever.

So, excuse me if I am wrong here, it seems she does have a kinky side. Don't know if it is called being submissive or whatever, but there is something here and I do believe I see only the surface of an iceberg here. Maybe it is a big iceberg, maybe it is a small one. But there seems to be more under the surface.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Luthor View Post
Like some others have mentioned, it is important to talk about these things while not being influenced by arousal. It may be awkward, but sitting down at a table and asking her, "What are you interested in sexually?" may be the best way for you to find out exactly what it is she wants.
I plan on doing that at some time. Talk with her in a neutral ground (not in bed) about sex. What she likes over the things we do. Why she likes it. If she likes something other we can try. But I am rather sure her response will be:
I do not know what I like/ I do not know why I like it/ I do not know why I do not like it/ I do not know if I want to try something new.

Which leads to my confusion (about the future, because right now I will stick with spanking and bondage and see how it goes). How can I learn what she wants to try and why she likes what we do right now. The way I see it, excuse me if I am wrong here) it shall work right this: You like spanking. So you like feeling pain. So, probably, you may also like to feel pain at your nipples for example. Or at your pussy. That is a conversation I will definitely have with her. But if her response to: Why do you like spanking? Is: I do not know, then I cannot move any further from there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luthor View Post
I'd be careful to assume that wanting to be told what to do, asking you to eat her out, or allowing other things you've asked her to do indicates that she actually likes those things. Even if she is a "submissive," not all like/want sexual things-- but will often tolerate/pursue it to please their partner. Even more so if you keep pressuring her to try new things, she may avoid saying things in fear of displeasing you.

Which goes back to: what has actually been communicated? Your intent to try new sexual things? Your intent to only do things she likes? Things she actually likes, rather than just things she accept to make you happier?
As I explained before, I am only doing things to her she likes. I have made it more than clear to her that we will never do something she does not want or like. And whenever she feels uncomfortable for any reason, we stop immediately. Her well-being is my number one priority. And then, her having more fun. Even more. She has told me quite a few times that sex with me is always awesome and she never had such sex before.

So, to answer your question, the "kinky" things we tried till now are all things she asked for. She hasn't accepted any of the things I would probably like us to do (cause I have not asked her anything yet, actually)
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:56 PM   #40
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Wedgiebondagebabe,

Thanks for the good answer again.

About spanking, my best guess right now is that she likes feeling pain only while being aroused. The same goes for bondage. I started thinking about that when this happened:
I told her I am not going to fuck her at that night (big story, why I said that) and she cannot touch my dick at all. She kept trying to touch my dick and I warned her like, I dunno, 5 times, that if she keeps trying to do that I will tie her down till she calms. So the ,lets say, 6th time, I did tie her hands. She stayed there for some few seconds, did calm down, and told me she doesn't like being tied like this. That it feels like being punished. My best guess, is that she likes pain/bondage/whatever, as long as it does not feel like a punishment. Could this be really true? I do not really know.

About going down on her, I have never thought that she might thing that she has to give me back the favor. She is indeed shy and feels she is really bad at sex in general. That is why, at least that was her response, does not want to suck me. Because she said: I know you are not enjoying it when I suck you and you will never be. I am trying to encourage her about this and see how it goes. I am just trying to figure out what the response : I like having my pussy liked if I am in the mood, means. Why does she not like it always? Cause she does like it in general but she somehow fools herself in believing that she does not...

About ending the relationship: I am not even considering that. It sounds funny even to read about it. I have a great time with her in general (not only bed) and I have never felt that way before. About sex, it is already fucking great (sorry for the fucking word) so it is not "essential" to add more things. I just think, or actually, feel, that if we do add more things she can have much stronger orgasms and more fun in general. I am mostly concerned about her, not me.
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Old 01-17-2017, 03:53 PM   #41
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Well, actually, plenty of people don't like getting their pussy licked all the time. Don't think that this means something is wrong or you are doing something incorrectly. She could have a sensitive clit, or she might need to be in a specific mindset to enjoy oral sex. Try to take into consideration her mental and emotional state when she is telling you she doesn't like something. For many people, different aspects of sex are tied to very specific moods, and she may not be in the "mood" to be licked, but may be in the mood for pain, or penetrative sex, or whatever.

As for her interest in pain, asking her what feels like a "punishment" to her is a good place to start. It's not uncommon for people to view spanking as an act of punishment. Presenting to her alternatives such as biting, scratching, hair-pulling, or pinching might give her a better set of activities to choose from that don't feel like traditional punishments. Also, it could be the location or implement. For instance, spanking her ass with your bare hand may feel like a punishment, but smacking her boobs with a crop or flogger may not feel like a punishment.
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Old 01-17-2017, 06:07 PM   #42
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To make this clear. Our sexual life started absolutely vanilla. We both had fun that way. I never even imagined that she had a "kinkier" or whatever is called (I hate labels) side. Then at some point she told me that I can do whatever I want with her, which kinda surprised me, and I am still trying to figure out what it means. My best guess, is that she told me in her own way that she likes "following" me in sex. Then after some time, she told me she likes two things I do not do to her: spanking, and pulling her hair. So I started doing those things and she indeed loves them. Then bondage also came into play (I am sorry but I cannot remember exactly how) and now we are experimenting also with that. Moreover, in the process I am describing above, I was gaining more "control" during sex, and both she and I love that.
Boy, you could've saved yourself some trouble here with that info. Sounds like you've been doing things well on that regard.

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I do not want to put pressure on her, I do not want her to feel uncomfortable or whatever. I am just confused by some of her reactions and not being an experienced person in such matters I do not know how to interpret them. That is why I asked for some help/advice.

. . .

I plan on doing that at some time. Talk with her in a neutral ground (not in bed) about sex. What she likes over the things we do. Why she likes it. If she likes something other we can try. But I am rather sure her response will be:
I do not know what I like/ I do not know why I like it/ I do not know why I do not like it/ I do not know if I want to try something new.

. . .

The way I see it, excuse me if I am wrong here) it shall work right this: You like spanking. So you like feeling pain. So, probably, you may also like to feel pain at your nipples for example. Or at your pussy. That is a conversation I will definitely have with her. But if her response to: Why do you like spanking? Is: I do not know, then I cannot move any further from there.
May not be the time to try to focus on the why. Even I'm not entirely sure why I like the things that I do-- despite I thinking about it a lot. The answers to those questions can be complicated-- and being ready to handle and accept the "I don't know" responses are important for communication, comfort, and support.

The process and the "what" seems more important. Does she want to continue experiment? What sort of time-frame does she want that to happen on? Is there anything that'd help her feel more safe or confident in those situations?


[/QUOTE]

Quote:
Originally Posted by msesi View Post
Wedgiebondagebabe,
I know you are not enjoying it when I suck you and you will never be. I am trying to encourage her about this and see how it goes.
It feels a bit silly asking this, but do you enjoy it when she sucks you? How does it feel? What does it do to your brain/thought? Do you want more of it? Does she want you to ask? Maybe you could make it open to her more? (anytime?)

We're glimpsing a bit more into what where your relationship was, is, and could be. It sounds like it has potential.
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Old 01-17-2017, 06:31 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by msesi View Post
Wedgiebondagebabe,

Thanks for the good answer again.

About spanking, my best guess right now is that she likes feeling pain only while being aroused. The same goes for bondage. I started thinking about that when this happened:
I told her I am not going to fuck her at that night (big story, why I said that) and she cannot touch my dick at all. She kept trying to touch my dick and I warned her like, I dunno, 5 times, that if she keeps trying to do that I will tie her down till she calms. So the ,lets say, 6th time, I did tie her hands. She stayed there for some few seconds, did calm down, and told me she doesn't like being tied like this. That it feels like being punished. My best guess, is that she likes pain/bondage/whatever, as long as it does not feel like a punishment. Could this be really true? I do not really know.

About going down on her, I have never thought that she might thing that she has to give me back the favor. She is indeed shy and feels she is really bad at sex in general. That is why, at least that was her response, does not want to suck me. Because she said: I know you are not enjoying it when I suck you and you will never be. I am trying to encourage her about this and see how it goes. I am just trying to figure out what the response : I like having my pussy liked if I am in the mood, means. Why does she not like it always? Cause she does like it in general but she somehow fools herself in believing that she does not...

About ending the relationship: I am not even considering that. It sounds funny even to read about it. I have a great time with her in general (not only bed) and I have never felt that way before. About sex, it is already fucking great (sorry for the fucking word) so it is not "essential" to add more things. I just think, or actually, feel, that if we do add more things she can have much stronger orgasms and more fun in general. I am mostly concerned about her, not me.
You are in a much different place writing this then when you started the thread. That is a positive step in the right direction. Please feel free to PM me because there are things I would like to say that I really do not feel like having out in the open on this thread because they are a lot deeper into my personal mind and emotions, but they might help give you a way you could look into her mind even though her mind could be and probably is different. It might help give you a jumping off point.

I do want to reiterate one more thing though. You have been in a relationship for 4 months. Another perspective on why she's holding back could be that its moving too fast for her. She might have all these desires and things she likes in her head that she can't explain and at times they come out uncontrollably. After they happen she might having a hard time letting go again. She might doubt how fast she's moving and that might be another thing thats holding her back. For some people having sex in four months is fast. For some its normal on the first date. So maybe the speed of the relationship could be the thing providing the mental block and as time goes, the trust builds, and the relationship establishes, the walls might be easier to break and come down if she wants to let you in that way. Time and communication are key. Good luck.
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Old 05-30-2017, 08:21 AM   #44
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Loving pain/restraints doesn't make someone a submissive. They could be a masochist. I think that the definition of your girlfriend a submissive may be off track.

Listen to her. She doesn't feel comfortable (her reasons) with what you want to do (your reasons). And neither party's reasons matter here because one party is not feeling comfortable.

You have a desire to control her, which is likely to be against her wishes. It's no longer a kink; it is now torture (psychologically) and it's going to strain the relationship.

Think about it.
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